Big bang without God???

[J-man]

He may be a worldly genius but in my opinion he's a Heavenly idiot. I'm all for people having their own opinion even though I don't agree but this guy appears to be a sour guy mad at the world. I've watched many of his shows and specials and he is quite interesting at times, I'll give him that.

http://science.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/17/17797756-stephen-hawking-lays-out-case-for-big-bang-without-god?lite

 

[Grey Colson]

I agree. I've watched his programs many, many times and am amazed how worldly smart he is. But you are correct. He goes out of his way to leave God out of his calculations. But even Hawking, with all his intelligence, can not explain how everything came from nothing. The "Big Bang" theory is still just that....a theory.

It could very well be that God exploded everything into existence. That would explain how everything came from the "void" of nothing. That is the only explaination and scientists will never discover another origin for it.

They are also having great difficulty with "dark matter". The substance that can not be seen or measured. The matter that even they admit holds the entire universe together. To me it is as simple as the faith God gives us. "Dark Matter" is simply the hand of almighty God himself.

Poor Stephen. He may refuse to not believe now, but I hope he will realize one thing before he goes out into eternity. There are no atheists in hell.

ray

 

[Foxmeister]

I agree. I've watched his programs many, many times and am amazed how worldly smart he is. But you are correct. He goes out of his way to leave God out of his calculations. But even Hawking, with all his intelligence, can not explain how everything came from nothing. The "Big Bang" theory is still just that....a theory.

It could very well be that God exploded everything into existence. That would explain how everything came from the "void" of nothing. That is the only explaination and scientists will never discover another origin for it.

They are also having great difficulty with "dark matter". The substance that can not be seen or measured. The matter that even they admit holds the entire universe together. To me it is as simple as the faith God gives us. "Dark Matter" is simply the hand of almighty God himself.

Poor Stephen. He may refuse to not believe now, but I hope he will realize one thing before he goes out into eternity. There are no atheists in hell.

ray

I agree. The Big Bang Theory is nothing more than a theory because those who believe this is the way things were created cannot prove it. They cannot explain how those elements causing the "Big Bang" were created to begin with.

 

[Grey Colson]

I agree. I've watched his programs many, many times and am amazed how worldly smart he is. But you are correct. He goes out of his way to leave God out of his calculations. But even Hawking, with all his intelligence, can not explain how everything came from nothing. The "Big Bang" theory is still just that....a theory.

It could very well be that God exploded everything into existence. That would explain how everything came from the "void" of nothing. That is the only explaination and scientists will never discover another origin for it.

They are also having great difficulty with "dark matter". The substance that can not be seen or measured. The matter that even they admit holds the entire universe together. To me it is as simple as the faith God gives us. "Dark Matter" is simply the hand of almighty God himself.

Poor Stephen. He may refuse to not believe now, but I hope he will realize one thing before he goes out into eternity. There are no atheists in hell.

ray

I agree. The Big Bang Theory is nothing more than a theory because those who believe this is the way things were created cannot prove it. They cannot explain how those elements causing the "Big Bang" were created to begin with.

And Brother Fox, they say we are crazy for what we believe. Their so-called "logical" explaination is that....from a singularity....a point in space that is too small to be seen....everything in the universe exploded from it.

I watch these science programs for a couple of reasons. #1 I find them very interesting #2 It's interesting to watch these people stumble all over themselves when they try to explain the universe absent creation.

I have a nice watch on today. Do you know where I bought it? Well, actually I didn't buy it. I just happen to be standing near a watch factory that exploded and all the little springs, hands and everything else that makes up a watch just fell into place at my feet. AND it works....go figure!

 

[Foxmeister]

I agree. I've watched his programs many, many times and am amazed how worldly smart he is. But you are correct. He goes out of his way to leave God out of his calculations. But even Hawking, with all his intelligence, can not explain how everything came from nothing. The "Big Bang" theory is still just that....a theory.

It could very well be that God exploded everything into existence. That would explain how everything came from the "void" of nothing. That is the only explaination and scientists will never discover another origin for it.

They are also having great difficulty with "dark matter". The substance that can not be seen or measured. The matter that even they admit holds the entire universe together. To me it is as simple as the faith God gives us. "Dark Matter" is simply the hand of almighty God himself.

Poor Stephen. He may refuse to not believe now, but I hope he will realize one thing before he goes out into eternity. There are no atheists in hell.

ray

I agree. The Big Bang Theory is nothing more than a theory because those who believe this is the way things were created cannot prove it. They cannot explain how those elements causing the "Big Bang" were created to begin with.

And Brother Fox, they say we are crazy for what we believe. Their so-called "logical" explaination is that....from a singularity....a point in space that is too small to be seen....everything in the universe exploded from it.

I watch these science programs for a couple of reasons. #1 I find them very interesting #2 It's interesting to watch these people stumble all over themselves when they try to explain the universe absent creation.

I have a nice watch on today. Do you know where I bought it? Well, actually I didn't buy it. I just happen to be standing near a watch factory that exploded and all the little springs, hands and everything else that makes up a watch just fell into place at my feet. AND it works....go figure!

To say an explosion created the universe alone is ludicrous. If an explosion resulted in the Earth being formed and life in the form of plants, human life, and animals resulted from it. How many explosions from any cause have you seen result in the creation of life?

 

[Grey Colson]

I agree. I've watched his programs many, many times and am amazed how worldly smart he is. But you are correct. He goes out of his way to leave God out of his calculations. But even Hawking, with all his intelligence, can not explain how everything came from nothing. The "Big Bang" theory is still just that....a theory.

It could very well be that God exploded everything into existence. That would explain how everything came from the "void" of nothing. That is the only explaination and scientists will never discover another origin for it.

They are also having great difficulty with "dark matter". The substance that can not be seen or measured. The matter that even they admit holds the entire universe together. To me it is as simple as the faith God gives us. "Dark Matter" is simply the hand of almighty God himself.

Poor Stephen. He may refuse to not believe now, but I hope he will realize one thing before he goes out into eternity. There are no atheists in hell.

ray

I agree. The Big Bang Theory is nothing more than a theory because those who believe this is the way things were created cannot prove it. They cannot explain how those elements causing the "Big Bang" were created to begin with.

And Brother Fox, they say we are crazy for what we believe. Their so-called "logical" explaination is that....from a singularity....a point in space that is too small to be seen....everything in the universe exploded from it.

I watch these science programs for a couple of reasons. #1 I find them very interesting #2 It's interesting to watch these people stumble all over themselves when they try to explain the universe absent creation.

I have a nice watch on today. Do you know where I bought it? Well, actually I didn't buy it. I just happen to be standing near a watch factory that exploded and all the little springs, hands and everything else that makes up a watch just fell into place at my feet. AND it works....go figure!

To say an explosion created the universe alone is ludicrous. If an explosion resulted in the Earth being formed and life in the form of plants, human life, and animals resulted from it. How many explosions from any cause have you seen result in the creation of life?

Excellent point! :thumbsup They usually destroy, not create.

 

[lotstodo]

First of all, people greatly simplify what scientists refer to as the big bang. It's far too complex to go into here, but read up. Wonderful things occurred around that time in the history of the universe. Secondly, just because we don't know the answer to something is no reason to attribute it to magic, God, or anything else that defies the laws of physics. Thirdly, it is widely hypothesized and mathematically demonstrated (but not proven) that time existed before the "big bang". This would logically lead one to believe that "something" existed before then. There are many areas of research in physics, mathematics, and cosmology in an effort to find what that something might be. Many of them are absolutely fascinating, and go far beyond what was thinkable even a few years ago, and every one of them are within the boundaries of physics as we understand it. Of course, some of them have to be wrong, but that's OK. That's how we learn.

Unlike religion, science changes almost daily as new and exciting discoveries refine and sometimes completely revise or disprove previous hypothesis without claims of sacrilege against the discoverer (unless we are dealing with global warming, but I digress). Who could have imagined black holes or dark matter just a few decades ago. They were first hypothesized using the laws of physics and math, and later observed. This is how science operates. One can accept the unknown for just what it is. We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will, and to think we can know it all, or that anything we don't currently know is supernatural, is not only counter intuitive, but it places much greater importance on our existence and current abilities to reason than evidence suggests. Against the history of time, we as a species are mere seconds old. We have a lot of learning to do, and if we don't blow ourselves up or get in the way of a cataclysmic event, we can and will discover the answers to the questions we ask. We may even be able to answer the why question.

Personally, I think that the answer to that question is currently unknowable. There is no evidence to suggest any explanation, and I'm OK with that. I just wonder at the happy confluence that we live in and that we can ponder these questions. It's pretty great stuff.

 

[ShoeDiva]

First of all, people greatly simplify what scientists refer to as the big bang. It's far too complex to go into here, but read up. Wonderful things occurred around that time in the history of the universe. Secondly, just because we don't know the answer to something is no reason to attribute it to magic, God, or anything else that defies the laws of physics. Thirdly, it is widely hypothesized and mathematically demonstrated (but not proven) that time existed before the "big bang". This would logically lead one to believe that "something" existed before then. There are many areas of research in physics, mathematics, and cosmology in an effort to find what that something might be. Many of them are absolutely fascinating, and go far beyond what was thinkable even a few years ago, and every one of them are within the boundaries of physics as we understand it. Of course, some of them have to be wrong, but that's OK. That's how we learn.

Unlike religion, science changes almost daily as new and exciting discoveries refine and sometimes completely revise or disprove previous hypothesis without claims of sacrilege against the discoverer (unless we are dealing with global warming, but I digress). Who could have imagined black holes or dark matter just a few decades ago. They were first hypothesized using the laws of physics and math, and later observed. This is how science operates. One can accept the unknown for just what it is. We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will, and to think we can know it all, or that anything we don't currently know is supernatural, is not only counter intuitive, but it places much greater importance on our existence and current abilities to reason than evidence suggests. Against the history of time, we as a species are mere seconds old. We have a lot of learning to do, and if we don't blow ourselves up or get in the way of a cataclysmic event, we can and will discover the answers to the questions we ask. We may even be able to answer the why question.

Personally, I think that the answer to that question is currently unknowable. There is no evidence to suggest any explanation, and I'm OK with that. I just wonder at the happy confluence that we live in and that we can ponder these questions. It's pretty great stuff.

:thumbsup I must say I ) @ "We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will"

 

[Grey Colson]

First of all, people greatly simplify what scientists refer to as the big bang. It's far too complex to go into here, but read up. Wonderful things occurred around that time in the history of the universe. Secondly, just because we don't know the answer to something is no reason to attribute it to magic, God, or anything else that defies the laws of physics. Thirdly, it is widely hypothesized and mathematically demonstrated (but not proven) that time existed before the "big bang". This would logically lead one to believe that "something" existed before then. There are many areas of research in physics, mathematics, and cosmology in an effort to find what that something might be. Many of them are absolutely fascinating, and go far beyond what was thinkable even a few years ago, and every one of them are within the boundaries of physics as we understand it. Of course, some of them have to be wrong, but that's OK. That's how we learn.

Unlike religion, science changes almost daily as new and exciting discoveries refine and sometimes completely revise or disprove previous hypothesis without claims of sacrilege against the discoverer (unless we are dealing with global warming, but I digress). Who could have imagined black holes or dark matter just a few decades ago. They were first hypothesized using the laws of physics and math, and later observed. This is how science operates. One can accept the unknown for just what it is. We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will, and to think we can know it all, or that anything we don't currently know is supernatural, is not only counter intuitive, but it places much greater importance on our existence and current abilities to reason than evidence suggests. Against the history of time, we as a species are mere seconds old. We have a lot of learning to do, and if we don't blow ourselves up or get in the way of a cataclysmic event, we can and will discover the answers to the questions we ask. We may even be able to answer the why question.

Personally, I think that the answer to that question is currently unknowable. There is no evidence to suggest any explanation, and I'm OK with that. I just wonder at the happy confluence that we live in and that we can ponder these questions. It's pretty great stuff.

:thumbsup I must say I ) @ "We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will"

Very accurate IMHO. If we don't change our ways, we're gonna get wiped and flushed so fast, we won't even realize what hit us. :'(

 

[J-man]

First of all, people greatly simplify what scientists refer to as the big bang. It's far too complex to go into here, but read up. Wonderful things occurred around that time in the history of the universe. Secondly, just because we don't know the answer to something is no reason to attribute it to magic, God, or anything else that defies the laws of physics. Thirdly, it is widely hypothesized and mathematically demonstrated (but not proven) that time existed before the "big bang". This would logically lead one to believe that "something" existed before then. There are many areas of research in physics, mathematics, and cosmology in an effort to find what that something might be. Many of them are absolutely fascinating, and go far beyond what was thinkable even a few years ago, and every one of them are within the boundaries of physics as we understand it. Of course, some of them have to be wrong, but that's OK. That's how we learn.

Unlike religion, science changes almost daily as new and exciting discoveries refine and sometimes completely revise or disprove previous hypothesis without claims of sacrilege against the discoverer (unless we are dealing with global warming, but I digress). Who could have imagined black holes or dark matter just a few decades ago. They were first hypothesized using the laws of physics and math, and later observed. This is how science operates. One can accept the unknown for just what it is. We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will, and to think we can know it all, or that anything we don't currently know is supernatural, is not only counter intuitive, but it places much greater importance on our existence and current abilities to reason than evidence suggests. Against the history of time, we as a species are mere seconds old. We have a lot of learning to do, and if we don't blow ourselves up or get in the way of a cataclysmic event, we can and will discover the answers to the questions we ask. We may even be able to answer the why question.

Personally, I think that the answer to that question is currently unknowable. There is no evidence to suggest any explanation, and I'm OK with that. I just wonder at the happy confluence that we live in and that we can ponder these questions. It's pretty great stuff.

Don't misunderstand me, I am fascinated with science, physics, and astronomy but as much as I want to believe "man" knows exactly what happened millions, even billions, of years ago my spirit won't allow me to be deceived. Especially when I consider all the "known facts" which affected future decisions only to find out they were incorrect or disproved later. Man's arrogance never ceased to amaze me. I pray for Mr. Hawkins, that he will see the light before the end of his time here on earth. Reminds me of my high school physics teacher who was adamant that science trumps religion, we had several class debates and discussions. He is now a humble pastor who brings the World of God with great vigor. I would love nothing more than to sit with him and discuss what changed his opinion.

Love science, believe God. That's just my opinion.

 

[Grey Colson]

First of all, people greatly simplify what scientists refer to as the big bang. It's far too complex to go into here, but read up. Wonderful things occurred around that time in the history of the universe. Secondly, just because we don't know the answer to something is no reason to attribute it to magic, God, or anything else that defies the laws of physics. Thirdly, it is widely hypothesized and mathematically demonstrated (but not proven) that time existed before the "big bang". This would logically lead one to believe that "something" existed before then. There are many areas of research in physics, mathematics, and cosmology in an effort to find what that something might be. Many of them are absolutely fascinating, and go far beyond what was thinkable even a few years ago, and every one of them are within the boundaries of physics as we understand it. Of course, some of them have to be wrong, but that's OK. That's how we learn.

Unlike religion, science changes almost daily as new and exciting discoveries refine and sometimes completely revise or disprove previous hypothesis without claims of sacrilege against the discoverer (unless we are dealing with global warming, but I digress). Who could have imagined black holes or dark matter just a few decades ago. They were first hypothesized using the laws of physics and math, and later observed. This is how science operates. One can accept the unknown for just what it is. We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will, and to think we can know it all, or that anything we don't currently know is supernatural, is not only counter intuitive, but it places much greater importance on our existence and current abilities to reason than evidence suggests. Against the history of time, we as a species are mere seconds old. We have a lot of learning to do, and if we don't blow ourselves up or get in the way of a cataclysmic event, we can and will discover the answers to the questions we ask. We may even be able to answer the why question.

Personally, I think that the answer to that question is currently unknowable. There is no evidence to suggest any explanation, and I'm OK with that. I just wonder at the happy confluence that we live in and that we can ponder these questions. It's pretty great stuff.

Don't misunderstand me, I am fascinated with science, physics, and astronomy but as much as I want to believe "man" knows exactly what happened millions, even billions, of years ago my spirit won't allow me to be deceived. Especially when I consider all the "known facts" which affected future decisions only to find out they were incorrect or disproved later. Man's arrogance never ceased to amaze me. I pray for Mr. Hawkins, that he will see the light before the end of his time here on earth. Reminds me of my high school physics teacher who was adamant that science trumps religion, we had several class debates and discussions. He is now a humble pastor who brings the World of God with great vigor. I would love nothing more than to sit with him and discuss what changed his opinion.

Love science, believe God. That's just my opinion.

That's me to a "T" Brudda! :thumbsup

 

[lotstodo]

First of all, people greatly simplify what scientists refer to as the big bang. It's far too complex to go into here, but read up. Wonderful things occurred around that time in the history of the universe. Secondly, just because we don't know the answer to something is no reason to attribute it to magic, God, or anything else that defies the laws of physics. Thirdly, it is widely hypothesized and mathematically demonstrated (but not proven) that time existed before the "big bang". This would logically lead one to believe that "something" existed before then. There are many areas of research in physics, mathematics, and cosmology in an effort to find what that something might be. Many of them are absolutely fascinating, and go far beyond what was thinkable even a few years ago, and every one of them are within the boundaries of physics as we understand it. Of course, some of them have to be wrong, but that's OK. That's how we learn.

Unlike religion, science changes almost daily as new and exciting discoveries refine and sometimes completely revise or disprove previous hypothesis without claims of sacrilege against the discoverer (unless we are dealing with global warming, but I digress). Who could have imagined black holes or dark matter just a few decades ago. They were first hypothesized using the laws of physics and math, and later observed. This is how science operates. One can accept the unknown for just what it is. We are a small group in the vastness, a speck on the butt of the universe if you will, and to think we can know it all, or that anything we don't currently know is supernatural, is not only counter intuitive, but it places much greater importance on our existence and current abilities to reason than evidence suggests. Against the history of time, we as a species are mere seconds old. We have a lot of learning to do, and if we don't blow ourselves up or get in the way of a cataclysmic event, we can and will discover the answers to the questions we ask. We may even be able to answer the why question.

Personally, I think that the answer to that question is currently unknowable. There is no evidence to suggest any explanation, and I'm OK with that. I just wonder at the happy confluence that we live in and that we can ponder these questions. It's pretty great stuff.

Don't misunderstand me, I am fascinated with science, physics, and astronomy but as much as I want to believe "man" knows exactly what happened millions, even billions, of years ago my spirit won't allow me to be deceived. Especially when I consider all the "known facts" which affected future decisions only to find out they were incorrect or disproved later. Man's arrogance never ceased to amaze me. I pray for Mr. Hawkins, that he will see the light before the end of his time here on earth. Reminds me of my high school physics teacher who was adamant that science trumps religion, we had several class debates and discussions. He is now a humble pastor who brings the World of God with great vigor. I would love nothing more than to sit with him and discuss what changed his opinion.

Love science, believe God. That's just my opinion.

J-man, the fact that science changes is why we can know what we know, but we cannot be wedded to it. Our knowledge is growing and we are not infallible, but not being infallible does not mean we are incapable. Not one scientist alive today will tell you that they are certain that existence began with the big bang. Not one. This is a common misnomer among those who don't understand the physics and observations that led to the big bang theory. The fact that it was an important time when this iteration of this universe began to rapidly expand does not mean that the singularity was the beginning of everything. It was simply the singularity as determined with a high degree of certainty to have existed by physics.

As for man's arrogance, I completely agree. I personally find it the height of arrogance to state that everything we don't know must be supernatural because we know all there is to know of the physical universe. That assumes that we will never grow intellectually or scientifically, and we are at our peak. That's arrogance, and that is simply incorrect. We are still learning and answering. If we don't know the answer to something, it simply means that we have yet to understand, not that the answer is unknowable or not compliant with the laws of physics. In fact I would say that historically, the concept that man is the son of God might put far more misplaced importance on our existence and abilities that science does. That's a pretty important station.

You can't really argue science vs. religion, because they are completely different things. Religion requires faith and science requires evidence. They are not mutually exclusive, and one cannot adequately replace the other. It is only when faith attempts to replace science that humanity suffers for it. This is not just me speaking, many religious leaders, including the current and past Pope, have said the same thing, and religion has followed science, albeit sometimes kicking and screaming. Such was eventually the case following Galileo, and countless others.

I mean no disrespect. I understand the place that faith has in society. Like you say, one can understand science and have faith in a God at the same time. The singularity, or any other scientific theory does not and cannot disprove such an existence because belief in that existence does not require evidence, and science is exclusively in the evidence business. I just disagree when people try to use that faith to disprove science, because for the same reasons, that can't work either. I wouldn't say that science trumps religion. I don't know how it could. That is entirely a personal determination based upon one's faith. You and I likely have differing points of view on that, and that's OK. We can discuss such things here openly even if we disagree.

 

[Blazing Saddles]

I used to believe just as Hawking presents himself but as we've probed deeper in space and the atom, it has become clear to me that there is too much order at each level too say it was by random chance. We are told that a universe created itself with matter and the laws that govern it. All this happened by chance. If chance is true, what I'm told happened isn't statistically possible. I'm to believe that the laws that govern everything were established after the fact? And if they were here before, then how and from whom? Everything in the universe was supposedly packed into something so tight it could fit in your hand? The laws that caused this compaction, where did it derive? The energy law that caused the explosion, where did it come from? Questions the elite can't answer or agree upon. Does it discount the whole premise? Maybe not, but to teach it as "rock solid" doctrine? No way.

I'm still trying to learn more and more every day.

 

[lotstodo]

I used to believe just as Hawking presents himself but as we've probed deeper in space and the atom, it has become clear to me that there is too much order at each level too say it was by random chance. If chance is true, what I'm told happened isn't statistically possible. I'm to believe that the laws that govern everything were established after the fact? And if they were here before, then how and from whom? Everything in the universe was supposedly packed into something so tight it could fit in your hand? The laws that caused this compaction, where did it derive? The energy law that caused the explosion, where did it come from? Questions the elite can't answer or agree upon. Does it discount the whole premise? Maybe not, but to teach it as "rock solid" doctrine? No way.

Where did the laws of physics come from? That is the $64,000 question. We know how the universe behaves and that it behaves according to these laws, but we don't know why. But like I said, not knowing everything does not equal not knowing anything, or that what we do know is somehow tainted by that fact. Faith may point us toward an answer as to why, but I don't personally believe that it is the answer. I am personally content in knowing that it does exist, it is a place of some order, and that it is a place of endless wonder and profound happenings. I'm glad to be here and relish the opportunity to exist and know the wonders of life. It's an incredible experience.

As for the singularity existing, it is indeed within the laws of physics. It is a fantastic concept, but reliably proven. I have trouble wrapping my brain around a lot of things out there and the singularity is indeed one of them. I am fascinated by black holes. They are similar to the singularity, but on a much smaller scale. Their gravitational force is so strong that they can warp time and light cannot escape. Wow. The best part is that they were proven using the same techniques that were used to describe the singularity, and then they were actually observed. Wow again.

The question of order is not scientifically bizarre. Order is the preferred state of matter and energy. Nothing is completely random at every level. The universe that we know requires balance of countless forces to exist. It's fantastic, but not supernatural. The universe obeys the Second Law of Thermodynamics and the laws of statistical mechanics. Mathematically, given a large enough set of anything, there will statistically be a subset that shows order, and that subset may be selected for those properties. The universe, in effect, seeks equilibrium (this is a much simplified version for the purposes of this discussion).

 

[Blazing Saddles]

I'm fascinated with the universe as well. Quite frankly, I watch everything on tv and try to read a lot pertaining to it. Maybe that's my appeal toward Star Wars. Lol!

 

[lotstodo]

I'm fascinated with the universe as well. Quite frankly, I watch everything on tv and try to read a lot pertaining to it. Maybe that's my appeal toward Star Wars. Lol!

PBS did a fantastic series on String Theory and Membrane Theory. Now those are the guys who are really out there. I love their attitude and dedication even though they know that there is a big chance that they will either hit a dead end or prove themselves wrong in their lifetime. They still come to work every day for years with a smile on their faces. Now that's dedication to science.

Those guys are so so far over my head that I can only understand a very small portion of what they are trying to prove, but I still find it completely fascinating. I hate to admit it, but over 40 years of non-use, misuse and abuse of these brain cells have left me at a distinct disadvantage.

 

[honeybunny]

Only God could explain the existence of Stephen Hawking...



8)

 

[mei lan]

I'm fascinated with the universe as well. Quite frankly, I watch everything on tv and try to read a lot pertaining to it. Maybe that's my appeal toward Star Wars. Lol!

PBS did a fantastic series on String Theory and Membrane Theory. Now those are the guys who are really out there. I love their attitude and dedication even though they know that there is a big chance that they will either hit a dead end or prove themselves wrong in their lifetime. They still come to work every day for years with a smile on their faces. Now that's dedication to science.

Those guys are so so far over my head that I can only understand a very small portion of what they are trying to prove, but I still find it completely fascinating. I hate to admit it, but over 40 years of non-use, misuse and abuse of these brain cells have left me at a distinct disadvantage.

OK, well, that tears it for me understanding it, then. I was gonna start a topic the other day to get somebody to explain string theory/quantum physics to me in a way I could understand it. Because I surely did not understand what I was reading. But never mind...

 

[mei lan]

I agree. The Big Bang Theory is nothing more than a theory because those who believe this is the way things were created cannot prove it. They cannot explain how those elements causing the "Big Bang" were created to begin with.

I am a strange one because I can see how the Big Bang could have happened, with God behind it. I'll create a s/o topic when I have a bit more time...

 

[J-man]

I used to believe just as Hawking presents himself but as we've probed deeper in space and the atom, it has become clear to me that there is too much order at each level too say it was by random chance. If chance is true, what I'm told happened isn't statistically possible. I'm to believe that the laws that govern everything were established after the fact? And if they were here before, then how and from whom? Everything in the universe was supposedly packed into something so tight it could fit in your hand? The laws that caused this compaction, where did it derive? The energy law that caused the explosion, where did it come from? Questions the elite can't answer or agree upon. Does it discount the whole premise? Maybe not, but to teach it as "rock solid" doctrine? No way.

Where did the laws of physics come from? That is the $64,000 question. We know how the universe behaves and that it behaves according to these laws, but we don't know why. But like I said, not knowing everything does not equal not knowing anything, or that what we do know is somehow tainted by that fact. Faith may point us toward an answer as to why, but I don't personally believe that it is the answer. I am personally content in knowing that it does exist, it is a place of some order, and that it is a place of endless wonder and profound happenings. I'm glad to be here and relish the opportunity to exist and know the wonders of life. It's an incredible experience.

As for the singularity existing, it is indeed within the laws of physics. It is a fantastic concept, but reliably proven. I have trouble wrapping my brain around a lot of things out there and the singularity is indeed one of them. I am fascinated by black holes. They are similar to the singularity, but on a much smaller scale. Their gravitational force is so strong that they can warp time and light cannot escape. Wow. The best part is that they were proven using the same techniques that were used to describe the singularity, and then they were actually observed. Wow again.

The question of order is not scientifically bizarre. Order is the preferred state of matter and energy. Nothing is completely random at every level. The universe that we know requires balance of countless forces to exist. It's fantastic, but not supernatural. The universe obeys the Second Law of Thermodynamics and the laws of statistical mechanics. Mathematically, given a large enough set of anything, there will statistically be a subset that shows order, and that subset may be selected for those properties. The universe, in effect, seeks equilibrium (this is a much simplified version for the purposes of this discussion).

One can look towards the sciences similarly to philosophy or even religion and I personally applaud the work of those who further our knowledge in many areas. It's wonderful that people spend their lives studying, analyzing, and theorizing in their line of academia as we "advance" our civilization. I for one don't believe we know a fraction of what we think we know nor do I personally believe we should know everything. A theory is only valid until disproved. Obviously if an apple falls it will eventually hit the ground but there's a big stretch to get to where we "know", or think we know, the single moment of creation millions of years ago. We are the same people who can't even balance a budget, much less a checkbook, or consistently deliver mail. For a renowned genius to stand up (no pun intended) and proclaim it all happened without any help from a Creator is just appalling. I pray for his soul because it's as broken as his body.